WotC (D&D at least) not attending Gen Con....
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Posted by studnougat wavester

wavester wrote:The only things they are not doing, and the thing that has some here all riled up, is having a big shiny expensive presence at Gen Con. I would say "Who cares?" but this thread shows that some do. Why?  Yes I get they used to own Gen Con, D&D started the industry, blah blah blah. I get it. I've been around a long time. How does Wotc deciding to spend $50K, or $100K+ or even $200K+ at this specific show somehow make the game better? How does it bring in the number of new players it would take to offset that cost? It really says nothing more then "We are successful enough at what we are doing to blow $XXXX in making a big fancy statement at show YYYY for everybody to oohhhh and ahhhhh at". The people I see complaining are already enfranchised players who know exactly what D&D is and exactly how to go about acquiring / playing it. How does them spending $20K to bring in a giant statue for you to take your picture next to exactly help?

There is something to be said about the "spectacle" of a huge presence at Gencon.  I love seeing the castle walls, statues, and all the decorations, it definitely adds a lot to my experience at Gencon, but it surely doesn't do a lot to bring any new people to the game.  (Although if it costs $20K to bring in a statue - DANG). 

Also, thanks for all the hard work putting AL stuff together.  There have been hiccups along the way, but in the end I got to play by DnD brains out at Gencon!

Posted by brotherbock firvulag

firvulag wrote:
LOL.  I Remember my first year at Gen Con...had never played 4e DnD and played there for the first (and last) time.  After my first session I walked up and down the trade hall looking for a PHB and could find one NOWHERE for sale.
AT GENCON!!!

One of the first places I drove all by myself when I first got my license was an hour or so away to Lake Geneva, to TSR headquarters. 

To discover that they didn't have the gigantic store of all TSR products there that I imagined. In fact, no store at all. Just corporate offices. In fact in fact, there was no hobby or gaming store in Lake Geneva. In the home of D&D, there was no place to buy D&D. 

Life is tragic, and terribly hard, sometimes. 

Posted by firvulag brotherbock

brotherbock wrote:
firvulag wrote:
LOL.  I Remember my first year at Gen Con...had never played 4e DnD and played there for the first (and last) time.  After my first session I walked up and down the trade hall looking for a PHB and could find one NOWHERE for sale.
AT GENCON!!!

One of the first places I drove all by myself when I first got my license was an hour or so away to Lake Geneva, to TSR headquarters. To discover that they didn't have the gigantic store of all TSR products there that I imagined. In fact, no store at all. Just corporate offices. In fact in fact, there was no hobby or gaming store in Lake Geneva. In the home of D&D, there was no place to buy D&D. 
Life is tragic, and terribly hard, sometimes. 

Except going to a "corporate office" and expecting them to have products for sale is a bit different than going to a trade hall and expecting them to have products for sale.

For instance if I visited the home offices of GM I wouldn't expect them to have a Hummer show room.

Hell, I can't hardly find 5e DnD stuff at my local game shops (much less their corporate offices) so Amazon is getting ALL of that business now.

But you've certainly schooled me in pointing out how silly my expectations were:  finding rule books for a game on the trade floor of a convention that is essentially centered around THAT game.

I thank you for the lesson.

Posted by brotherbock

If that's what you wanted to take from my post, more power to your victimization. It likely won't matter if I say that wasn't my intent. 

Posted by firvulag brotherbock

brotherbock wrote:
If that's what you wanted to take from my post, more power to your victimization. It likely won't matter if I say that wasn't my intent. 

Not sure exactly how I was "victimizing" myself.  I was simply sharing an anecdote in support of the op's original premise.  Whether it added to the discussion or didn't is a matter of personal opinion.

Your last statement was:  Life is tragic, and terribly hard, sometimes. .  

When you get to be my age you realize that what I described was neither tragic nor terribly hard in the big scheme of things....so I did read some snarkiness into that. 

If it was misplaced then I apologize.  Emotions, intentions, and  such are sometimes hard to fathom on a public forums.

Posted by brotherbock

I was simply sharing something that seemed mildly relevant. I was not trying to 'school' you or 'teach you a lesson'. It did in fact seem tragic to 16 year old me, who had saved up some money and had gone on the road trip of his life (it was, I swear, maybe a whole hour and a half away) to score big on D&D and be the envy of my friends. That was a sad drive home.

But I also am sorry for the misunderstanding.  Your reply seemed to be an overreaction to what I intended in my post, and clearly there is *no* reason why anyone should ever misread *my* masterfully written and perfectly clear posts on the Internet :) 

I'm actually with you on the frustration of not being able to find D&D at GenCon. I don't need the big corporate machine in attendance. But game material would be nice. 

Peace. 

Posted by genconkeeper

Now ICV2 ran story a few days ago about HasbroCon. About how Hasbro had enought IP's material to put on a major media con. Funny they used to have their own con it was called Gen Con.  Their are plenty of companies to run one for them but fandom is getting pretty burned out from all the conventions such as there is.  ICV2 had some interesting takes.
http://icv2.com/articles/news/view/34490/hasbro-marks-hasbrocon

Randu

Posted by daveculp brotherbock

brotherbock wrote:I'm actually with you on the frustration of not being able to find D&D at GenCon. I don't need the big corporate machine in attendance. But game material would be nice. 
Peace. 

Do you mean game material for sale?  WotC has never sold game material (or only sold very limited quantities) at Gen Con even when they had a presence.  However there will LOTS of D&D material for sale at the various vendors.  

If you mean games, there are hundreds of D&D games in the event catalog.  There are "official" D&D game run by Baldman games and lots of independent run games. 

In truth, most people wont notice a difference as  WotC has not had a huge presence at Gen Con the last 4-5 years.

Posted by austicke daveculp

daveculp wrote:WotC has never sold game material (or only sold very limited quantities) at Gen Con even when they had a presence.

Are you sure? I remember them selling their products in their castle (at full retail) for many years.
 

Posted by qwaserity

I was lucky enough to work for WOTC at GenCon 2010. Yes, we did have stuff to sell but the quantities were limited. We were pushing Magic on the Xbox (got to demo that all Saturday morning) and the new Orcus mini. We had a lifesize combat map with giant minis and d20s. We gave away hundreds of the Magic game on USB drives.

In short, the booth was more about getting the brand recognition over selling product. Everything that you bring to a con that you don't sell you have to pack up (or give to your wonderful volunteers). The only other thing I remember selling that year was the Magic Vault Relics set as I still have one.

Posted by h2so4

Meh, Gen Con is under the law of diminishing returns. It's big, but it's a mess of general mud. Other conventions offer more actual D&D players as well as more intimate surroundings to cater to them. Gen Con is just no longer worth it for anyone not inspired by cattle calls and chaos.

That's not to say WotC doesn't also have convention issues. The last D&D Championship Open wasn't even allowed in the WotC area because they were gung-ho on promoting Fan Service 5E.

If you're a relative nobody in gaming, Gen Con is great because of the raw amount of foot traffic. If you're actually well-established, you're really just there for show. 

Posted by wavester austicke

austicke wrote:
daveculp wrote:WotC has never sold game material (or only sold very limited quantities) at Gen Con even when they had a presence.

Are you sure? I remember them selling their products in their castle (at full retail) for many years.
 

They had a castle once upon a time but that was in Milwaukee. That castle never made it to Indy. They've had smaller set pieces and other companies selling books for them but Wotc themselves have not sold D&D books at Gen Con I am pretty sure since before 4E. 

Posted by austicke wavester

wavester wrote:They had a castle once upon a time but that was in Milwaukee. That castle never made it to Indy. They've had smaller set pieces

Well, perhaps the older "castle" was more impressive, but WotC did indeed have castles for many years in Indy. It was originally in the exhibit hall but moved to a separate area for its last couple years.

Here's a photo from 2014.

Posted by melkor

Lol, that ruin is a good metaphor for Wizard's presence at Gencon these days. Comparing it to the old MECCA and Midwest Express Center Castles especially.

Posted by braewe

I loved doing THE VERY BRIEF (which means the line moved quickly) little encounter thing in the dealer hall a couple years ago. Made my kids' day. Okay and mine too, with rolling the huge d20. May have been more than a couple years ago actually. Whichever year you could collect the dice doing different things.

And y'know, it's true, bringing the statues and castles probably does not increase wotc's sales directly, but it certainly increases good will. I loveloveloveloveloved getting pictures with those things. LOVED. The poses you could ham! Funniest I saw was with someone else posing...they had some sort of futuristic guns trained on it, with someone in a portal outfit ready to zap it away. Good times.

Posted by daveculp austicke

austicke wrote:
daveculp wrote:WotC has never sold game material (or only sold very limited quantities) at Gen Con even when they had a presence.

Are you sure? I remember them selling their products in their castle (at full retail) for many years.
 
At Gen Con Indy they have sold stuff the last 4-5 years but only limited quantities of a small subset of their inventory.  

Posted by lanefan

Most important, the statues and castle and all gave WotC (and thus D&D) a "presence" which it no longer has.

Last year when it came to RPG promotion it seemed to be all Pathfinder all the time, whether in the ICC or the surrounding pubs.  Great if you like Pathfinder...

It'll be interesting to see if WotC do anything next year regarding the 50th GenCon and all the history involved...a history which, like it or not, they are in large measure custodians of.

Posted by brotherbock daveculp

daveculp wrote:
brotherbock wrote:I'm actually with you on the frustration of not being able to find D&D at GenCon. I don't need the big corporate machine in attendance. But game material would be nice. 
Peace. 

Do you mean game material for sale?  WotC has never sold game material (or only sold very limited quantities) at Gen Con even when they had a presence. 

I meant to refer to his post about a previous year not being able to find game material for sale. I wasn't looking that year, so I am neither confirming nor denying. Just referring to his claim. 

Posted by brotherbock h2so4

h2so4 wrote: Gen Con is just no longer worth it for anyone not inspired by cattle calls and chaos.

Blatantly false, as it is still worth it to me, and I am inspired by neither. Your determination of its worth is just that--yours. 

Posted by njseahawksfan h2so4


If you're a relative nobody in gaming, Gen Con is great because of the raw amount of foot traffic. If you're actually well-established, you're really just there for show. 
Other than Wizards, I just don't find this to be true at all.  All of the major players in RPG and Board Gaming are at GenCon year after year.  It's one of the main reasons I go ... to see and demo the latest offerings from companies both large and small.

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