Official Gen Con specific only Coronavirus thread
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Posted by lore seeker raidkillsbugsded

raidkillsbugsded wrote:
chaoticneutral262 wrote:
I wonder how long the will call line would be if everyone had to stand 6 feet from the next person.

pretty long

Which is probably why they'll do away with Will Call this year. That's my guess, anyway.

Posted by dballing lore seeker

father bloodlust wrote:
raidkillsbugsded wrote:
chaoticneutral262 wrote:
I wonder how long the will call line would be if everyone had to stand 6 feet from the next person.

pretty long

Which is probably why they'll do away with Will Call this year. That's my guess, anyway.

You can't easily do away with will-call.  You've got international attendees where it can take weeks or months for the mail to get to where they are. And which has a non-trivial chance of being lost en route. Historically, Gen Con has taken the position of "a badge lost in the mail will not be replaced" because there's no way to invalidate a lost badge. So you can't force people to use a mail system where they might be screwed out of their badge. And if you tell them "just go to customer service" you've just created will-call again and renamed it customer-service. :-)

 

Posted by lore seeker dballing

dballing wrote:
father bloodlust wrote:
raidkillsbugsded wrote:
chaoticneutral262 wrote:
I wonder how long the will call line would be if everyone had to stand 6 feet from the next person.

pretty long

Which is probably why they'll do away with Will Call this year. That's my guess, anyway.

You can't easily do away with will-call.  You've got international attendees where it can take weeks or months for the mail to get to where they are. And which has a non-trivial chance of being lost en route. Historically, Gen Con has taken the position of "a badge lost in the mail will not be replaced" because there's no way to invalidate a lost badge. So you can't force people to use a mail system where they might be screwed out of their badge. And if you tell them "just go to customer service" you've just created will-call again and renamed it customer-service. :-) 

No Will Call for US customers then? It wouldn't completely eliminate the Will Call line, but it would certainly cut it down.

Posted by mikeboozer dballing

dballing wrote:
father bloodlust wrote:
raidkillsbugsded wrote:
chaoticneutral262 wrote:
I wonder how long the will call line would be if everyone had to stand 6 feet from the next person.

pretty long

Which is probably why they'll do away with Will Call this year. That's my guess, anyway.

 Gen Con has taken the position of "a badge lost in the mail will not be replaced" because there's no way to invalidate a lost badge. 

A badge that is marked as lost by the post office is replaced by us at no cost. This happens quite a few times. It shows in your tracking. Plus all badges that are returned to us are taken to the convention in their packets for pick up. We get a ton of these.

If a badge is marked as delivered (We track them and you can to on your "My packets" page) then we will not replace it.

Mike

Posted by dballing mikeboozer

mikeboozer wrote:
dballing wrote:
father bloodlust wrote:
raidkillsbugsded wrote:
chaoticneutral262 wrote:
I wonder how long the will call line would be if everyone had to stand 6 feet from the next person.

pretty long

Which is probably why they'll do away with Will Call this year. That's my guess, anyway.

 Gen Con has taken the position of "a badge lost in the mail will not be replaced" because there's no way to invalidate a lost badge. 

A badge that is marked as lost by the post office is replaced by us at no cost. This happens quite a few times. It shows in your tracking. Plus all badges that are returned to us are taken to the convention in their packets for pick up. We get a ton of these.If a badge is marked as delivered (We track them and you can to on your "My packets" page) then we will not replace it.
Mike

I stand corrected. I think that was a problem a while back (~ 7-8 years ago or so) because I remember people complaining about it, but I'm happy to hear it is not the situation today :-)

Posted by fatherofone mumsnarf

mumsnarf wrote:
fatherofone wrote:
Today's numbers in Indiana continues the good news.   
566 people tested positive out of 4697.   Continues the good trend.
ICU bed usage continues to be exactly the same for a month of 17.3%  So even though a lot of people are being tested positive fewer are requiring ICU.  
Deaths of people below 50 years old is still under 3%.  People 50-60 remains at 5.8% again.
Also per MSM, it appears that you can't get the virus multiple times.   This is perhaps the best news of all.    
Another very good day for the numbers.   

I keep seeing this type of argument and I don't think these numbers have anything to do with this situation. It doesn't matter that Indiana's cases are trending down, it will not be eradicated by July. Gencon draws 70K guests from all over the world and a lot of its staff from the worst hotspots in Indy. Unless they are requiring three negative tests before entering the con, some will be infected.Please check out this case study from an office building in Korea:
https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/8/20-1274_article
One infected person without major symptoms infected 94 coworkers in one week. Gencon is much more crowded and fluid in movement of people than an office building, and given the incubation period people infected on Tues-Wed will likely be shedding virus by the weekend. I don't see any reasonable way for Gencon to lower the risk of a major outbreak to an acceptable level. 
 It sucks, but this is the first year I am not going in about a dozen straight. 

I am not trying to say what will or will not happen, but the numbers are the numbers.   I understand that there are reasonable people who really believe that Gencon shouldn't happen and some want to push that belief on others.   I get it, and I disagree at the moment.  When hospital beds haven't gone up, deaths are limited to those with pre-existing conditions, then I tend to believe like most that opening up the economy is the right decision.

Now if the number spike like crazy then we should pivot on that decision.  As it stand now though the numbers from a percentage have been going down and down.   

I would tell anyone who is over the age of 60 and or is in bad health to use their best judgement, but then again I would say that every year.   So again the numbers are very important.  Can someone come from China and infect a bunch more people?  Yes, but that could always happen and it could be a new flu that does it, but not COVID.   The question a person in good health under the age of 60 has to ask is this.  Is this a real risk or not?   Again the numbers are the numbers.  People under 60 in good health are doing fine.  Things are getting a LOT better and things are opening back up.  That coupled with the new news that once you have COVID you can't get it again bodes very well.   I could point to another stat, but I can't verify it.  It says something like only 10% of those that had covid got tested.  If that is the case then we are now looking better than ever.  

Posted by dballing fatherofone

fatherofone wrote:
mumsnarf wrote:
fatherofone wrote:
Today's numbers in Indiana continues the good news.   
566 people tested positive out of 4697.   Continues the good trend.
ICU bed usage continues to be exactly the same for a month of 17.3%  So even though a lot of people are being tested positive fewer are requiring ICU.  
Deaths of people below 50 years old is still under 3%.  People 50-60 remains at 5.8% again.
Also per MSM, it appears that you can't get the virus multiple times.   This is perhaps the best news of all.    
Another very good day for the numbers.   

I keep seeing this type of argument and I don't think these numbers have anything to do with this situation. It doesn't matter that Indiana's cases are trending down, it will not be eradicated by July. Gencon draws 70K guests from all over the world and a lot of its staff from the worst hotspots in Indy. Unless they are requiring three negative tests before entering the con, some will be infected.Please check out this case study from an office building in Korea:
https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/8/20-1274_article
One infected person without major symptoms infected 94 coworkers in one week. Gencon is much more crowded and fluid in movement of people than an office building, and given the incubation period people infected on Tues-Wed will likely be shedding virus by the weekend. I don't see any reasonable way for Gencon to lower the risk of a major outbreak to an acceptable level. 
 It sucks, but this is the first year I am not going in about a dozen straight. 

I am not trying to say what will or will not happen, but the numbers are the numbers.   I understand that there are reasonable people who really believe that Gencon shouldn't happen and some want to push that belief on others.   I get it, and I disagree at the moment.  When hospital beds haven't gone up, deaths are limited to those with pre-existing conditions, then I tend to believe like most that opening up the economy is the right decision.Now if the number spike like crazy then we should pivot on that decision.  As it stand now though the numbers from a percentage have been going down and down.   
I would tell anyone who is over the age of 60 and or is in bad health to use their best judgement, but then again I would say that every year.   So again the numbers are very important.  Can someone come from China and infect a bunch more people?  Yes, but that could always happen and it could be a new flu that does it, but not COVID.   The question a person in good health under the age of 60 has to ask is this.  Is this a real risk or not?   Again the numbers are the numbers.  People under 60 in good health are doing fine.  Things are getting a LOT better and things are opening back up.  That coupled with the new news that once you have COVID you can't get it again bodes very well.   I could point to another stat, but I can't verify it.  It says something like only 10% of those that had covid got tested.  If that is the case then we are now looking better than ever.  

But again - this isn't just about the numbers in Indiana or Marion County, it's about the numbers everywhere, and how those numbers impact other folks' willingness to travel and expose themselves to tens of thousand of people.

Posit for a moment:Indiana has *0* covid cases. None. It completely vanishes between now and July. But only in Indiana. In the rest of the country, some parts remain steady, some parts have started their predicted second wind. Folks from those states are under lockdown orders. They're not allowed to travel.  Do you think they'll want to go visit Indiana, even if they were somehow able to? Now you might argue "well, Indiana is safe!" except that the convention wouldn't just be people from Indiana, it'd be people from all over the country, all over the world, all [potentially] bringing covid with them to Indiana.

If those non-Indiana folks decide to stay home, can Gen Con break even on just Indiana natives showing up?  Can the vendors who cart their wares there? (Never mind that in this hypothetical, large chunks of the vendors can't show up either, further diminishing Gen Con's revenue source).

Now, obviously, this is a hyperbolic example, but it illustrates the reality that the Indiana numbers really, honestly, are only a very very small part of the equation. You have to look at the WHOLE situation and not just fixate on Indiana.

Posted by lore seeker

As a note on that "you can't get Covid-19 twice" thing: we don't know that for sure yet. There haven't been formal studies done on it apparently, and even if it does provide immunity, it's unknown 1) How much immunity it provides and 2) How long that immunity lasts.

I went Google searching for news stories about this, and I haven't been able to find any articles from less than a week ago providing any kind of update on this news.

Posted by cutter2020

I have a question and a few comments. I have been watching this thread closely and I am wondering if the gravity of the situation is being clearly addressed. My first comment would have to be about safety. Beyond hand soaps and face masks what type of safety can Gen Con realistically guarantee? There is no vaccine as of yet. Besides that fact what happens if we are all in the dealer hall all socially distanced and someone yells that they have the virus? That could and would create a panic and possibly cause a stampede. All if not almost all conventions have already cancelled and postponed. What is Gen Cons delay? It does not seem logical or practical or even reasonable at this point to have a convention. In light of this pandemic crisis it just seems almost cruel to the fans of Gen Con leaving everybody in limbo. Here is a link that discusses this very subject if you care to read more. https://www.tor.com/2020/03/15/coronavirus-the-sci-fi-fantasy-conventions-canceled-so-far/#comment-866436

Posted by lehane dballing

dballing wrote:
fatherofone wrote:
mumsnarf wrote:
fatherofone wrote:
Today's numbers in Indiana continues the good news.   
566 people tested positive out of 4697.   Continues the good trend.
ICU bed usage continues to be exactly the same for a month of 17.3%  So even though a lot of people are being tested positive fewer are requiring ICU.  
Deaths of people below 50 years old is still under 3%.  People 50-60 remains at 5.8% again.
Also per MSM, it appears that you can't get the virus multiple times.   This is perhaps the best news of all.    
Another very good day for the numbers.   

I keep seeing this type of argument and I don't think these numbers have anything to do with this situation. It doesn't matter that Indiana's cases are trending down, it will not be eradicated by July. Gencon draws 70K guests from all over the world and a lot of its staff from the worst hotspots in Indy. Unless they are requiring three negative tests before entering the con, some will be infected.Please check out this case study from an office building in Korea:
https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/8/20-1274_article
One infected person without major symptoms infected 94 coworkers in one week. Gencon is much more crowded and fluid in movement of people than an office building, and given the incubation period people infected on Tues-Wed will likely be shedding virus by the weekend. I don't see any reasonable way for Gencon to lower the risk of a major outbreak to an acceptable level. 
 It sucks, but this is the first year I am not going in about a dozen straight. 

I am not trying to say what will or will not happen, but the numbers are the numbers.   I understand that there are reasonable people who really believe that Gencon shouldn't happen and some want to push that belief on others.   I get it, and I disagree at the moment.  When hospital beds haven't gone up, deaths are limited to those with pre-existing conditions, then I tend to believe like most that opening up the economy is the right decision.Now if the number spike like crazy then we should pivot on that decision.  As it stand now though the numbers from a percentage have been going down and down.   
I would tell anyone who is over the age of 60 and or is in bad health to use their best judgement, but then again I would say that every year.   So again the numbers are very important.  Can someone come from China and infect a bunch more people?  Yes, but that could always happen and it could be a new flu that does it, but not COVID.   The question a person in good health under the age of 60 has to ask is this.  Is this a real risk or not?   Again the numbers are the numbers.  People under 60 in good health are doing fine.  Things are getting a LOT better and things are opening back up.  That coupled with the new news that once you have COVID you can't get it again bodes very well.   I could point to another stat, but I can't verify it.  It says something like only 10% of those that had covid got tested.  If that is the case then we are now looking better than ever.  

But again - this isn't just about the numbers in Indiana or Marion County, it's about the numbers everywhere, and how those numbers impact other folks' willingness to travel and expose themselves to tens of thousand of people.Posit for a moment:Indiana has *0* covid cases. None. It completely vanishes between now and July. But only in Indiana. In the rest of the country, some parts remain steady, some parts have started their predicted second wind. Folks from those states are under lockdown orders. They're not allowed to travel.  Do you think they'll want to go visit Indiana, even if they were somehow able to? Now you might argue "well, Indiana is safe!" except that the convention wouldn't just be people from Indiana, it'd be people from all over the country, all over the world, all [potentially] bringing covid with them to Indiana.
If those non-Indiana folks decide to stay home, can Gen Con break even on just Indiana natives showing up?  Can the vendors who cart their wares there? (Never mind that in this hypothetical, large chunks of the vendors can't show up either, further diminishing Gen Con's revenue source).
Now, obviously, this is a hyperbolic example, but it illustrates the reality that the Indiana numbers really, honestly, are only a very very small part of the equation. You have to look at the WHOLE situation and not just fixate on Indiana.
The Indiana numbers are required for the State of Indiana to reopen. If it seems like these numbers are being given more importance than numbers elsewhere it is cause if Indiana doesn't reopen then the numbers elsewhere are a moot point where it concerns Gencon. 

Posted by dballing lehane

lehane wrote:If it seems like these numbers are being given more importance than numbers elsewhere it is cause if Indiana doesn't reopen then the numbers elsewhere are a moot point where it concerns Gencon. 

Except they're not a moot point. You're thinking of this like John Hammond with Jurassic Park -- Just because Gen Con can open up, according to Indiana rules, doesn't mean it should open up.

For Gen Con to break even, it needs to care about attendees from other states and countries, and how their local numbers are affecting their local rules which are impacting their ability to travel. Or if their numbers just impacting their willingness to travel.

This is not just for any sort of health and safety reasons (although there are literally like rafts of those). If those attendees don't show up, if those vendors don't show up, if those event organizers don't show up, then you have a convention which is financially non-viable, and that becomes the last Gen Con because they go belly up with red-ink.

None of us are privy to Gen Con's finances, but I'll wager a crisp buck that they don't have a warchest that can eat that kind of loss.

Posted by lehane cutter2020

cutter2020 wrote:
I have a question and a few comments. I have been watching this thread closely and I am wondering if the gravity of the situation is being clearly addressed. My first comment would have to be about safety. Beyond hand soaps and face masks what type of safety can Gen Con realistically guarantee? There is no vaccine as of yet. Besides that fact what happens if we are all in the dealer hall all socially distanced and someone yells that they have the virus? That could and would create a panic and possibly cause a stampede. All if not almost all conventions have already cancelled and postponed. What is Gen Cons delay? It does not seem logical or practical or even reasonable at this point to have a convention. In light of this pandemic crisis it just seems almost cruel to the fans of Gen Con leaving everybody in limbo. Here is a link that discusses this very subject if you care to read more. https://www.tor.com/2020/03/15/coronavirus-the-sci-fi-fantasy-conventions-canceled-so-far/#comment-866436

Planet Comicon postponed from March to August 14th-16th. That is two weeks after Gencon. 

Steel City Comicon was rescheduled to the same dates as Planet Comicon. They postponed from April to June and now to August. 

It appears Wizardworld still has St. Louis (June), Philadelphia (June), and Chicago (August) on the Schedule. Their website does not have any cancellation news I can find on these three. 

Fan Expo Dallas is still selling tickets for late June. 

Gencon is not acting any differently. They are having to wait and see how things play out just like the rest of the Conventions are.

Now Indiana Comic Con has cancelled for the year but they were slated in June which was too early for the Governor's guideline for reopening for an event of that size. This is important cause the Governor would not allow it per his guidelines. They also use the ICC. However the Governor's Guidelines still allow for Gencon in August. And the Mayor of Indianapolis hasn't changed that by being more restrictive yet. 

So we are all still waiting. There is still 2 and half months until the slated dates for Gencon.

Posted by matthias9

I don't understand why so many people are focused on the Will Call line.

If 6ft social distancing guidelines are still a thing, Gen Con has far bigger problems than solving the badge pickup situation. 

Posted by lehane dballing

dballing wrote:
lehane wrote:If it seems like these numbers are being given more importance than numbers elsewhere it is cause if Indiana doesn't reopen then the numbers elsewhere are a moot point where it concerns Gencon. 

Except they're not a moot point. You're thinking of this like John Hammond with Jurassic Park -- Just because Gen Con can open up, according to Indiana rules, doesn't mean it should open up.For Gen Con to break even, it needs to care about attendees from other states and countries, and how their local numbers are affecting their local rules which are impacting their ability to travel. Or if their numbers just impacting their willingness to travel.
This is not just for any sort of health and safety reasons (although there are literally like rafts of those). If those attendees don't show up, if those vendors don't show up, if those event organizers don't show up, then you have a convention which is financially non-viable, and that becomes the last Gen Con because they go belly up with red-ink.
None of us are privy to Gen Con's finances, but I'll wager a crisp buck that they don't have a warchest that can eat that kind of loss.

No I am not thinking like John Hammond. 

Gencon is located in Indy, the numbers could be great in Japan, Great Britain, Argentina, Australia, etc. But if the numbers are bad for Indiana then Indiana doesn't reopen and Gencon is off regardless of the rest of the world. 

You completely ignored that condition when reading what I wrote. 

Posted by buffythecatslayer matthias9

matthias9 wrote:I don't understand why so many people are focused on the Will Call line.
If 6ft social distancing guidelines are still a thing, Gen Con has far bigger problems than solving the badge pickup situation. 

Exactly; trying to "solve" the Will-Call issue is like slapping a Band-Aid on a decapitation.  These people talking about distancing in the WC line seem to have never been to Gen Con.  The dealer hall & the gaming areas are the issue.  If TD somehow makes it, how do you distance 6-8 people inside a 10x10 room?

Posted by dgoodchild buffythecatslayer

buffythecatslayer wrote:
matthias9 wrote:I don't understand why so many people are focused on the Will Call line.
If 6ft social distancing guidelines are still a thing, Gen Con has far bigger problems than solving the badge pickup situation. 

Exactly; trying to "solve" the Will-Call issue is like slapping a Band-Aid on a decapitation.  These people talking about distancing in the WC line seem to have never been to Gen Con.  The dealer hall & the gaming areas are the issue.  If TD somehow makes it, how do you distance 6-8 people inside a 10x10 room?

I'll just leave this here…

Posted by gib_rebeg

I think people overlook the fact, that if Indiana continues to hit their five-stage plan, that come July 4th, the 6 foot distancing rule is no longer enforced. It becomes optional, along with face covering.

Stage 5Possible start dates: July 4What's new:


  • Retail stores and malls: May operate at full capacity
  • Restaurants, bars, and nightclubs: May operate at full capacity
  • Personal services: May open at full capacity
  • Gyms and fitness facilities: No restrictions
  • Large events: Conventions, sports events, fairs, festivals, the state fair and similar events may resume.
  • Amusement parks, water parks: Restrictions are lifted. Social distancing guidelines should be maintained.
  • Most vulnerable population: Hoosiers 65 and over and those with high-risk health conditions should follow social distancing guidelines and remain cautious. 

Posted by tinabear81 buffythecatslayer

buffythecatslayer wrote:
matthias9 wrote:I don't understand why so many people are focused on the Will Call line.
If 6ft social distancing guidelines are still a thing, Gen Con has far bigger problems than solving the badge pickup situation. 

Exactly; trying to "solve" the Will-Call issue is like slapping a Band-Aid on a decapitation.  These people talking about distancing in the WC line seem to have never been to Gen Con.  The dealer hall & the gaming areas are the issue.  If TD somehow makes it, how do you distance 6-8 people inside a 10x10 room?
Threadjack: Your avatar doggo looks so much like my sweet pupper.

Posted by austicke gib_rebeg

gib_rebeg wrote:I think people overlook the fact, that if Indiana continues to hit their five-stage plan, that come July 4th, the 6 foot distancing rule is no longer enforced.

Nope; that's incorrect. From the stage 5 documentation: "Social gatherings of over 250 people may take place following the CDC social distancing guidelines." See here.

_____________________________________
Alec Usticke, Fans of Gen Con Facebook Group

Posted by donaldbain austicke

austicke wrote:
gib_rebeg wrote:I think people overlook the fact, that if Indiana continues to hit their five-stage plan, that come July 4th, the 6 foot distancing rule is no longer enforced.

Nope; that's incorrect. From the stage 5 documentation: "Social gatherings of over 250 people may take place following the CDC social distancing guidelines." See here._____________________________________
Alec Usticke, Fans of Gen Con Facebook Group
But the
Large events: Conventions, sports events, fairs, festivals, the state fair and similar events may resume.
seems to contradict that.  No one can expect 6 foot spacing from a crowd at a sport event. 

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